Perfecting the Art of Loyalty to Drive Retention and Revenue

So we're going to spend a solid half hour or so here exploring loyalty and what it means today, how marketers can attain true loyalty, talk a bit about omnichannel marketing strategies as well and how they deepen those customer relationships. They can improve retention and drive this this growth. And to do all of that, I am in a few minutes going to be joined by a very distinguished panel of experts representing some fantastic brands. But before we do that, I'd like to set the stage a little bit, give you a few things to think about in terms of loyalty as we move forward that will hopefully nicely introduce the conversation to come. So, as marketers, we're always talking about customer loyalty. At least I find that we are. I'm constantly engaged with conversations with my peers and with you as our customers about about loyalty? How do we drive loyalty? How do we retain loyalty? What is that about? So, last year, we decided to do some research to say instead of asking marketers what do we think. We wanted to actually ask consumers. We wanted consumers to tell us what do they think about loyalty? How do they choose the brands? To whom they are loyal. What is it they want from us as marketeers when it comes to actually earning their loyalty? So we conducted a survey, which we called the customer loyalty index across five different countries around the world. And we were fascinated by the results. And they really felt they told us a lot about what loyalty is like today, in this digital first retail world are always on commerce world, and in a world where consumers are more and more control of their destiny and of the engagements and interactions that we have them. And I think what also goes to show is you can see the impact of the rather — of the turbulence over the last couple of years of all the change that we've seen within our industries. So as part of this exercise, we identified five different types of loyalty. And you can take a look at on the screen, and you can see a little bit about how they're defined. There's lots more information about that elsewhere if you really want to deep dive into it. And what you could also see is how our results compared year over year, because this was an index that we had done once before. And what really stood out for us is that in most cases there was quite a lot of change. But in that space of true loyalty, that unshakable loyalty that's built through brand love, which is the Nirvana for all of us as marketers, that didn't change. So why? Why is that the only constant? Why does that stay, stay so firm. Why do people stay so completely focused on that? Well, I think there are a number of reasons. I think one of the things that we're being told about is that superficial loyalty doesn't work anymore. And we've seen that demonstrated by consumers responding to discounting some of it potentially indiscriminate to do something specific. And the reality is, today's consumers are too sappy for that. They may take advantage of a purchase, but it's not going to drive their loyalty. And at the end of the day, we're probably giving away more and we actually gain, because we're hurting our margins, and we're hurting our own business. And we're not actually keeping customers with us in a sustainable way. Which means we have to, as marketers, truly focus on that true loyalty. And not just because it feels good, because sometimes it can sound a bit altruistic, because actually fundamentally, it does actually drive better business results. You actually see customers coming back over and over again, and you have an extended customer lifetime value, which is also something that so many of us are looking to achieve. And is perhaps no surprise that woven into that so fundamentally is personalization? Personalization is the key to those trusted loyal relationships. And it's what keeps those consumers coming back over and over and over again. And there's some interesting stats that we uncovered. That are on this slide that back up from a business standpoint that personalization has that true linked loyalty and that true linked to business. Thirty one percent of consumers saying that personalized shopping experiences are why they stay loyal to a brand. Brands saying that they see an eighteen percent increase in spend from customers to whom they deliver personalized offers. And fundamentally brands also seeing seventy five percent seventy five reduction in churn when using personalized offers. So, you can see that it's driving customer loyalty. You can see it's driving business impact. And I think that last metric. It's also always worth reminding ourselves how much more expensive it is for all of us to acquire a new customer. That it is to retain an existing customer. And again, the value of that existing customer, the value of that relationship really I don't think can be overstated. So, this brings us back to the fact that these omni channel personalized marketing engagements matter. And we opened today talking about the art and science of marketing. And I open today talking about the balance that we as marketers have to maintain. And I think this slide shows it yet again. We are balanced between these increasing consumer expectations. Their ability to shop where and when they want to, how they choose to. And they expect us to be there with the right offers at the right times. They're going to use more touch points than ever. Mobile being, you know, mobile being a classical one. I think one of the phrases that Kelsey used in her session just now is quite emotive. The fact that the mobile is in the palm of your hand. It's almost a part of you, right? It is attached to you at all times. That is the level of personalization you're trying to achieve that somebody has all the time with them as engaging with all the time. We have to earn the business of our customers And the only way we do that is through these tailored, relevant, personalized experiences that wins their business, wins their loyalty, wins their trust, both in the term and the long term. And that's actually what allows us at the end of the day to meet the business expectations that are constantly increasing. We're all being asked to focus on retention, customer lifetime value and revenue. We can't — if you do that in the context of customer loyalty, you see the impact. Almost everybody has tighter budgets and teams that are being asked to do more with less. Again, that fundamental of retaining that customer loyalty And as you start to think about scaling one to one marketing, then you're coming back to that, those truly personalized engagements, those those things that are actually going to keep the customer coming back to you time and time and time again. A couple of other staff that I will remind you of before we move on that Kelsey talked about. In a Forbes article, sixty five percent of respondents said they would become long term customers of a brand. Long term customers if they can provide consistent positive experiences throughout that brand's lifetime. And eighty percent of consumers are more like to purchase when brands offer experiences that are personalized to them. So we're being told on both sides that customers will engage with us and be more loyal to us, but they will also purchase from us. So it's good for us in terms of our customers and it's good for us in terms of our business to bring this true focus on loyalty. So, I hope that has teed up our conversation and given perhaps some food for thought, with, I think, a topic that is so top of mind for all of us. At this point, I am really pleased to be joined by a very distinguished panel experts in this area. Garrett Hughes, who is the technology director at Estate Lauder, Taylor Donald, who's the Vice President, Content and partner marketing at Jebbott, and Mary Ann Coling Oxholm, who's the head of CRM in retail marketing at Hobby, all of whom have experience and insights to bring to bear on these topics. So, what I'd like to do is to welcome them on and ask each of them if they perhaps could introduce themselves to all of you and give you a little bit more insight into their background. Garith, could you kick things off for us? Yeah. Hi, everyone. Thank you, Sarah. Nice to be here. Good morning. So I'm Garath. I'm the technology director for Estate Auto for North America. Have a role that covers a variety of different brands that we kind of own and operate. But primarily, I look after our consumer data platform where we ingest sort of our consumer data from our various consumer touch points. We normalize the data. We kind of review the data, and then we push it back out to those touch points and also to our CRM tools and our reporting platforms. Thank you, Garrett. I think hopefully everybody sees how that makes you rather uniquely positioned to talk about these topics, so I think you're going to have a lot to share with us, which is fantastic. How you feel it? Taylor? No doubt about it. No doubt about it. Taylor, do you think you could introduce yourself to our to our audience? I do. Thank you very much, Sarah. Yes. I'm Taylor Darnell. I have been with Jebid for nearly eight years now. I I spent the previous five years of my career overseeing integrated marketing at Warner Brothers and across all of T and Z's digital and on air properties. Jeb is actually a strategic partner of both of Mars and SAP. It is a platform where we offer really intuitive platform that helps businesses transform the way that they're interacting directly with consumers. And you can really think like dynamics, shoppable quizzes, interactive content that ultimately enable the collection of of next generation first party data. So really data that consumers self declare about their unique preferences, needs, lifestyles, intentions, and more. And the data that really can inform personal So I guess the TLDR of that is, brands couldn't create really engaging experiences. They collect really valuable data, and Obviously, those both play really pivotal roles in everything we're talking about when it comes to customer attention, loyalty, and lifetime value. I could not agree more. Thank you, Taylor. I think, again, we're going to look forward to some more depth on some of the insights I know you're going to share with us. And last but not least, Mary Ann? Yeah. Hello. And welcome to everyone. I'm working at Hubi, and I've been onboard for three years now, and I'm responsible for for the loyalty and and everything in the web channel, in the mobile channel, and the email channel, primarily. And Hubi is a huge young company located in Denver, but the biggest areas are German in the United States. I have the pleasure of four on one million subscribers to our emails and a customer club of two millions. So so it's a really fun place to be and working with automations, of course. And I have a lot to share about personalization and using data. Yeah. Wonderful. Thank you, Mary Anne. Welcome again to everybody. Why don't we get things started? So we're going to start, start talking to Anne, Mary Anne. I have a question for you if I could to kick things off. So thirty three percent that's a lot. Thirty three percent of marketing leaders are going to prioritize customer loyalty this year. And as you've already touched on, I know loyalty is fundamental to you in the business that you're in. Could you share with all of us a bit about your strategy to build true loyalty, that kind of loyalty that we were just talking about a few minutes ago? And also how that, how you're looking to increase your customer's lifetime value. Maybe there's two pieces there for you to dive into. Yeah. Yeah. We have so dedicated customers. It will be — it's — we're selling yam to knitters and crocheters. And actually, they really want to engage with us. As I see it, loyalty comes also from engagement from the customers. If you can get your customers to actually commute with you, then you have gone a long way in this true loyalty matter, I believe. So we, of course, make a whole lot of free patterns, but our customers are also sharing their patterns with us. So we are looking into strategic way where we actually would create a community and have started that journey. So at our website customers can share. They can they can recommend to each other. They can review a yarn or review a passion, and everyone can see that. So, you can give hearts like you can do in Facebook and everything. So, So we are going the community way. That is the loyalty pattern and what we're going into and And of course, we also use a whole lot of automations to keep this in track because it doesn't come by itself. Customers download a pattern and when you download, you also get data. So we know what kind of yarn do you like when you download a certain pattern for babies, it is for yourself, or is it interior, home stuff, or is it just little animals to crochet? And every time they download, we know more and more about the customers. And we can use this download also to remember them to share the picture and are they finished and we can give them points in the customer club. So they actually have been driven to to interact more and more with us Yeah. So so we actually just everything I do is actually about the community and get them involved in the brand. I love that. Thank you. Think that's a that's it's a it's a really nice I do have to call out because I haven't had a chance to hope everybody can see the background that Maria and she's obviously representing her brand as all marketers. Love to do. And I love the amazing colors of the yarn, which is just speaking for your brand and your whole approach. Thank you for bringing that visual for us as well. Could I do a little follow-up if you wouldn't mind on that? Which you, I suspect people here are thinking building a community probably isn't that easy, because I think many of us have tried to do it. And I don't think it's a short term. It's on a short term goal or short term project. Would you mind sharing a little detail about kind of the thought process and that, how long it's taken, some of the things you've done? I think it will be really interesting. Yeah. You can say we started way back when when Hube was founded. It's eight years ago now, but started by making it possible for everyone to to share pictures at the if they if you go into yarn, you could share pictures of a product you made with that yarn. And also if you have a pattern, you can share the the thing that you have knitted or crochet So that was the beginning. And this year, we actually launched that it's more community. We have a little button in the site. There's a community. But one of the things that that also is quite interesting and different because I think also loyalty comes by being being a brand and trying to be different maybe. So last year, we actually also started our app because we also want to be the community is the app. It's in the hand. It's always on. So how can we actually embrace this app? And we did it by eventing a bingo actually. Our customers are typical middle aged women. And everyone loves to interact with each other and there was corona. So we were also a a lot home. So we started the bingo. And from the beginning until now, every week, we have over we have nearly forty thousand players playing bingo. And you can win prices. It's not big prices. It's like eight skeins of Jan and points to your My Hopei account. But this, starting by this bingo actually got people involved in the app and then they got access to the community by the app and it was a good start and then we we have users on the app from the beginning. So it's also to kind of think out of the box I think and try to, how can we actually get people more and more into the brand and more and more commuting with each other? And when we play Bingo, they can commute with other. They can see everyone writing, hey, hello, from Copenhagen. Hello from Oldborg and Denmark and And we have it in the native language. So in the UK, of course, we speak English. But in Denmark, it's a Danish speaker. And in Sweden, it's Swedish speaker. And and everything. So we really want to be close to our customer and not distracted from the customer. So So I think that's that's my advice is to try to find the core of your brain, what do you represent and And of course, we go into the passionate stuff with the customers. That's a fantastic story, Mary. And I want to make sure that forty thousand people who play Bingo with you every week. Yeah. Yeah. And it's not the same thing. Yes. Yeah. It's it's they are sometimes, it's You can see it's also new players and they go in and out, of course. Yeah. And they're getting points every time they play Bingo. That's also how can we get them engaged? Is that, yeah, you need to to give them a benefit to interact with you. That is a fabulous and definitely inspiring story. And I think the part of it also too, which is gonna link really nicely as we're gonna of continue to chat is you thought about who your customers were, and this is — you've taken things to a level of personalization. You've offered them the kinds of things that they want to do. And demonstrated, you understand what they like, what they don't like, how they want to engage the kinds of things that they want to do. So I think that leads me quite nicely tailored to something I wanted to ask you about. And reflects thirty one percent of customers are citing that personalized shopping experiences are the reason they stay loyal to a brand. I think Marianne has has demonstrated a real life example of that extremely eloquently. When you're thinking about it, how are you thinking about using personalization to build relationships with customers? Yeah. Great great question. And Mary Ann, by the way, I live in in Boca Raton, Florida, and I think that you probably put all of the combined boat bingo games that are happening at any time in that city to to shame with your audience size. So that's great. But it it's spot on. It's it's truly it's A component of is is of course being native to who you are as a brand and your ethos, but it really boils down to that symbiotic relationship. Between brands and consumers. And and you do. You have to understand them. I it's been said multiple times already leading up to this, so weaves them nicely. But I really like to think about in where where we see brands and why brands use Jevit as really trying to go beyond just that last click or that last transactional purchase that oftentimes can inform personalization or messaging that consumers may receive as a result of of those actions. Understanding consumers at that level when when you can start to understand their preferences, the the things that motivate them, why they buy, what their needs are, their goals, even their goals with specific products, lifestyles are. It helps you not only personalize the consumer's experience. It also allows you to make it relevant. Right? So going beyond just traditional personalization tactics. And and we've got clients at Jebit really doing this at every every phase of the customer life cycle. So from the moment they acquire net new customer leads, there's an opportunity that that Jevita Ford's that. And they're also consistently going back to their existing customers just to engage with them and make sure that they have the most accurate and up to date data because things do change. Life comes at you fast. Right? And and life stages evolve, we we can look no further than COVID to to validate that. And what our outlook could have been in different categories in December of twenty nineteen versus April of twenty twenty. But ASIC is a great example. So kind of thing about those those phases of the life cycle, what they did was that they actually deployed a what type of runner are you personality quiz. They send it out to actually all existing customers. So it wasn't an acquisition play. What they really wanna do is make sure that they had each consumer in their database in the most relevant So consumers were answering questions about their running habits, how many times they ran a week, what their goals were, what motivated them to buy things like a new pair of running shoes, even questions about, like, content or events they might be interested in. And at the end, consumers within in real time dynamically mapped to not only a persona, they were shown unique products based on their interaction and what they told the ASIC in the moment. And then and then we're even then receiving content. Like, ASIC built a whole content player around this. So they got really thoughtful with those personas and those segments. And that quiz alone, I think it helped them, you know, enrich user profiles by, like, an average of twenty one point five first or zero party data attributes appended to those. And similarly, we work with a lot of beauty brands. So like NARS is a great example where And we actually do some work with this. They'll order as well, and they're aveda line. But on on their website, they've got a page of quizzes that sit across multiple categories. So you can think like find the right foundation for you. And what's great here is at the end of this experience, it lives natively on their site. So they can drive paid media to these. Users can organically find it. They can drive existing consumers. But before consumers are shown their recommended product, there's the option to submit their lead information to sign up to become a NARS insight And when they do, NARS now not only has a first name, last name, and email address. They have these seven to eight first party data attributes about skin tones, skin type, climate that they live in, goals, things that really do inform, like the recommendations of products that you're gonna show them, not just, hey, because you purchased this. So It really allows them to make the experience personalized relevant from the jump and trigger that next best message. So I think when you can use that data in the moment, it's huge. But I think it's imperative that when you get it and the consumers are willing to take that time to engage with you to actually interact with you to share information about themselves, you've gotta act on it. Right? And when you do and you show them that you care and that you're listening thoughtfully, right, and you're using their data truly to just enhance their experience and make it better, that's what starts to build and trust is really foundational to loyalty. Right? So I think that's those those are some of the ways that we see brands using it at a very high level, but it's all about just offer genuine value, show them you care, show them you're listening, be thoughtful, and be actionable. That's great. Thanks, Taylor. And I think that, yeah, all of that is about building relationships, right? And how do you build those relationships So using that kind of a segue, Garrett, when we talk about those buildings of relationships, one of the things that we found research that we did with Forrester is that brands that are customer obsessed, truly customer obsessed, are actually more likely to be using an omnichannel strategy. And finally enough, see up to a sixty two percent increase in margins, fifty two percent increase in customer interactions, fifty four percent increase in, you got it, customer retention and loyalty. So can you tell us from your perspective where you see the correlation between customer obsession and omnichannel? Coming into play? Yeah. Thanks, Sarah. So when I was when we were doing our consumer data platform in the UK, one of the things we used to refer to was this concept to the nineteen fifty shopkeeper in in relation to being customer obsessed. So you would come into a store that the person serving would know you, would know your preferences would know all about you. And I was trying to get back to this kind of relationship, but almost, you know, a mass market scale and how we could kind of have that relationship with our consumers, but, ultimately, in the hundreds of thousands millions rather than on a one to one basis. So I think with ours, you know, certainly the relationship between consumer obsession and omnichannel relationships is is is fairly clear. Customer centricity is is important. Both concepts kind of epitomized the importance of of putting the customer at the center. I think a customer obsessed organization, you know, essentially like ourselves understands that our customers have different preferences and expectations when they wanna interact with us. And I suppose that leads on nicely to the fact that from an omnichannel perspective and being, you know, customer centric, we should be able to offer them whatever experience they want in any channel. Ultimately, there should be a level of consistency across that channel. And that drives us with things like personalization for that consistency. So we need to understand that the same person that maybe in one of our stores they potentially shopped with us online last week. You know, at the same brands, we can pull up their preferences. We can look at past history. And we can, you know, look at any other kind of tailored data potentially that we we may have on them. I think the bit for us as well is to to kinda drive that relationship with the customers is to have that seamless customer journey. You know, I've had probably, like yourself, a number of really good experiences of omnichannel kind of journeys, and I'll probably tell you some really bad ones as well. But I think for us, it was a, you know, that whole seamless bit, you know, being able to shop in any channel. And I I lost talking to someone at the day. He said that, you know, you could almost remove the term omnichannel now for consumers and say it's any channel, you know, removes the fact that, you know, they should have the same experience regardless of, you know, in store online. And potentially marketplaces and things like that as well. Yeah, I couldn't, I couldn't agree more. I think that's, you know, if that's the thing else we're market earth, but we're also consumers, right? So we are creating these experiences, but we're also having them. So we bring, I think, all of that to it, as we think about it, And I think you've actually teed up something really quite nicely that I think I'd like to go back to Marian on because the under core of a lot of what you've talked about, and you touched on is data. So, Mary Ann, maybe you could talk a little bit about date, how data is important when it important when it comes to building these relationships and increasing loyalty. And how are some of the ways that you're using that data very specifically drive some of those loyalty building experiences that you were sharing with us a few moments ago. Yeah, we have, we have over eight million visits at our site every month. So it's quite a lot of and many of those are only visitors. And we really want to have them as, first of all, a permission to send them an email or of course a member of our customer that is for free. So we use the first data point that is crucial to us is actually getting them to download a pattern. And again, back to inspiration. So so sharing a lot of patterns and the availability to the customers where they can download a lot of patterns. And when they download, we actually have this content locking where we where we get the permission because we see us you like this pattern. Then please give us your email, and they can avoid this, of course, a little sign in the bottom. Yeah. You can also just download here, but most of the people actually gives us their email. And that is also why we have all four million subscribers, of course. When they download the it's it tells us a whole lot about the customer as I talk a little bit. Before we can we can see so many stuff about the customer, and this is good for personalization. But it's also good if you're just keeping that pattern itself, then I can show maybe it's not the right pattern they have found. So I can say in the email, I can make a a blog with other patterns in same area, but I can also show them other yarn types that they could actually use for this particular pattern. If we have made some video guides, guides for the pattern. We also have that in the email. So we actually use everything we can and just put it in this email. And it's not just keeping the liability up. You can also see that every email we send also, are giving revenue. Bottom line, revenue is why we're here. So so it's it's actually keeping the the customer really, really into our brand and it's in Again, our website, and everything. And after three weeks, we sent them a reminder to review the pattern. And I will finish, share your pictures, and every things. So really, we want to see what you're doing. And we are we're talking a one to one kind of tone. So so we try to be really close to our customers. Yeah. So that is one way to use data. We also we also have a lot of projects that is called CAL, like crochet along or knit alongs that is also like it could be a secret per project where they sign on for at tending on a and a project over four or five weeks and they also they only get a part of the pattern each week. And it's also community driven. It'll also like giving us new permissions. Maybe they have signed up. They don't wanna be on our permission. Data base But when they we have this, they are just like we cannot we really want to attend this. So and every time we help this, we have a lot of of, yeah, to participate on this. And And that data also shows us again what are they interested in and everything. And the points the points, if if you don't have a customer club, for us, it's really it's really a good thing because they can save the patterns they like. So it's like natural for them to just attend the club And they can also show, share a yarn that they love. If they do that, of course, we send them you have yarns on your wish list that actually has dropped in price. So it's just, yeah, everywhere I go are you stater, actually. That's fantastic. Actually, Mary Ann, if you don't mind while I'm with you, I've had a question come in that I'd like to share, if you wouldn't mind. Someone asked, what was your incentive for joining in on Bingo on the app? How did you incent people to do that? I Yeah. We used every channel that we had. So it's both the show me channels, Instagram, and Facebook. And in the emails we put in in the conference that we started on, just saying that, hey, play Bing with us, then you get I think we — did we gain them five hundred points maybe at the beginning to play? Now it's not — I think it's fifty if they play now. But in the beginning, we gave them many points to attempt and they can win prizes. And if in this This group of people, they would they are just fond of free stuff also. So actually came by itself and we were more surprised that we can keep the participants actually that we every time, every week, we haven't been under thirty thousand. So I think that is the most amazing part of it. It was easy to get them to the first bingo. That's great. Yes, not just that first thing, but that longevity. I think that's fantastic, Mary Ann. Thank you. It's a really great story. I'm conscious we're getting light on time, and I don't want to keep you all longer. Garath, could I ask you to wrap things up for us maybe with a slightly more future looking commentary. As you've all touched on, customer experience, is changing constantly, the things that you need to deliver for customers. There's so much to adapt to. What are the things that you see coming? And how do you think you're going to be adapting or potentially overcoming them if they're challenges? Yeah. I think there's a couple of common ones that we've probably had for the past few years. Anyway, I'm I'm gonna say personalization at scale that we talked about now. You know, our customers are now expecting kinda highly personalized experiences to their needs. But, obviously, we're getting more and more consumers as our as our customer base is growing and, you know, diversify as well. And I suppose that goes on to, you know, continually rising consumer expectations. You know, our customers are expecting faster response times, you know, twenty four seven report, support, proactive engagement, all of those kind of things. I think on the other side, probably one thing we we haven't really talked about is data privacy and security. I think that's kind of with, you know, our customers are kind of probably being, you know, certainly from the feedback we're getting are becoming more cautious about sharing their personalised information. I think we we've certainly prioritized data privacy and security. What we we're still gathering data, you know, like like every other they can see more organization that's in this space as well. I think as well we we touched on omnichannel, I think, you know, we're like, other people still looking at consistency, and I think we talked about you know, you know, brand dot com and in store. But, obviously, now we need to look at that consistency across other things like, you know, more mobile apps, social media, you know, we've kind of branched into TikTok and things like that. And kind of maintaining that consistent experience across all of those touch points, I think, will be it's certainly a challenge for us and potentially other organizations as well. I think the other piece just to finally for me were pretty around AI and automation. I think while this offers opportunities and, you know, to enhance our customer experiences, it is gonna take a lot of careful planning. And, you know, striking the right balance between, you know, whether that be human or AI driven interactions to kind of maintain that personalized and consistent customer service. Wonderful. That was a great wrap up. Thank you very much, Garrett. And thank you to Taylor and Marianne as well. I have very much appreciated the insights in the chat. I'm sorry, we couldn't do it live, but this was definitely the next best thing. I think there's a lot of things that we can all take away from this. I know there are conversations I would love to continue to have with you. But within the constructs of the time, we have thank you ever so much for your time. I hope everybody has enjoyed it and found as much value from it as I have. If you would like to dive some more into the sits of loyalty and retention. I would invite you to come to our Marsice retention and loyalty hub. There's some assets on there that will absolutely complement the conversations that we've been having today. I would point you towards a report called the omnichannel difference, which is something that we did forrester, and you'll absolutely start to dive into omnichannel strategy experience, and how that drives higher margins, and improved customer interactions, and all the things that My distinguished panelists have spoken about far more eloquently than I have. So I invite you to do there, and to have a play with our omnichannel marketing strategy maturity tool to help understand where you are on that curve and how you can move forward. If you have any questions for our distinguished panel, and there are things that you'd to follow-up on. There are some contact details available for you on the screen. Please do take advantage of that, or please also use the links to their bio in the omni channel hub. I think in terms of taking away from this, I think it's — we just reiterated that importance of true loyalty and how focusing on it is so important. And I don't think any of us are going to forget anytime soon Hubbie and their forty thousand participants that play Bingo through their app. I doubt many of us will be going to look at that. And see how we can take inspiration for that into our own marketing programs and our customer loyalty programs.